SunGodPortal's Burning Questions

1) They just have different gfx and defences. For instance small shield could also block the shooter's beam if it was programed that way.

Good. I hate the idea of different shields. Now I can just alter the GFX of shield 3 to something cool and just forget the other crummy shields.

-----------------------------

Where do all of the non-sense numbers in the room properties come from? Many of them have numbers listed for the stairs despite never having stairs.

Okay, so I made a post and then did some research and made another post and then did some more research so I'm just gonna delete them and start a new one...

I've been studying this in an attempt to figure out exactly which options are legit and which are bogus.



I already know the ones for items are bogus so we don't need to discuss them.

I studied the difference between two ROMs with HxD.

Appear to be legit: clear damaging pits, overworld exits, overworld sprites, dungeon sprites.

Appear to be bogus: Clear all torches, entrances, bird locations, whirlpools (and of course the ones for items).

Couldn't tell if the one for pushable blocks was legit or not. I'm guessing that it cleared the room numbers but does it clear the positions? If so, will it just rewrite that anyway?

Can anyone confirm this stuff?

Good. I hate the idea of different shields. Now I can just alter the GFX of shield 3 to something cool and just forget the other crummy shields.

That's one way of doing it.

Where do all of the non-sense numbers in the room properties come from? Many of them have numbers listed for the stairs despite never having stairs.

That's the side effect of expanding the header to maximum. The numbers need to be there, they are just never used.

Appear to be legit: clear damaging pits, overworld exits, overworld sprites, dungeon sprites.

Appear to be bogus: Clear all torches, entrances, bird locations, whirlpools (and of course the ones for items).

Couldn't tell if the one for pushable blocks was legit or not. I'm guessing that it cleared the room numbers but does it clear the positions? If so, will it just rewrite that anyway?

Can anyone confirm this stuff?

It is not really legit or not legit, it is what bugs the Rom and what not.

It is not exactly as you described it.

In order:
-clear all overworld items (this Can be used, but only if your goal is to not have any items in the overworld - which is a wise choice, since they always bug). But if you want to have items in the overworld and obviously don't use this. For instance I used this in GoT to get rid of all bugged overworld items.

-clear all overworld sprites (Can be used)

-clear all dungeon items (not recomended, since you want items indoors and you Don't want to empty them with this false command)

-clear all dungeon sprites (Can be used)

-clear pushable blocks (Can be done, since the code is fixed, this can not bug by default, no matter what you do - if there are 99 blocks at max)

-clear torches (Can be done, similar as blocks - data block is fixed, but it is still wiser to clear them up individually since the byte for the block-length might be calculated wrong with this command)

-clear all entrances (Can be used, data block is fixed)

-clear exits (Do NOT use this - it will erase some "invisible" exits - like the ones for the ending sequence and the one for going from Ganon's room to Triforce shrine)

-clear bird locations (Can be used, but it is safer to do this manually - only 9 locations exist)

-clear whirlpools (Can be done and recomended to then not add any whatsoever)

-clear holes (Can be done, but better of done separately)

-clear damaging pits (Can be done, data block is fixed)

From your post:
Appear to be legit: clear damaging pits, overworld exits, overworld sprites, dungeon sprites.

Appear to be bogus: Clear all torches, entrances, bird locations, whirlpools (and of course the ones for items).

So basically overworld exits are not legit (must not be used), while the torches, entrances, bird locations and whirlpools should not bug your rom if you use these commands. Still safer to remove bird locations manually and uppon removal of whirlpools don't add any. Entrances and torches are fine by default (like blocks or indoor tablet monologues), since the data block is fixed.

-clear all overworld items (this Can be used, but only if your goal is to not have any items in the overworld - which is a wise choice, since they always bug).

That still sounds bogus to me because 99.9% of people using it will be doing so because they will expect to be freeing up space that they can use for new item placement.

When I used "clear all holes" it didn't actually clear all of them. It left some behind.

I don't know what the difference was, but the first time I tested the "clear all" for bird locations and entrances it said "Can't add anymore...". Later I tried it again and it didn't have a problem with it. HM...

Side note: It's kind of funny that it says "anymore" instead of "any more" since they don't mean the same thing. I'm guessing that Sephiroth3 is not a native English speaker?


Anymore: She doesn't live here anymore. We don't sell those anymore.
Any more: You can't add any more bird locations.

The difference is subtle, but there is a difference none the less, just like "everyday" (ordinary, regular, expected) and "every day" (something that specifically happens every day).

SO... It sounds like the only ones I'm gonna trust are overworld sprites, dungeon sprites, damaging pits and pushable blocks. The rest seem questionable at this point for one reason or another...

I tried the "clear all entrances" 3 times on 3 ROMs and only one of those times did it not lead to "Can't add anymore entrances". I don't know what made the difference. It may work at times but it seems to be pretty unreliable.

67FB1: A9 02 33 9F C5 03 70 A9 05 01 9F C7 03 70 A9 00 00 9F 59 03 70 A0 00 00 60

I'm using this custom SRAM for one of my projects (start in pendant phase with no sword or shield) and I'd like for the player to be able to carry 50 bombs right from the start. I don't want them to start with 50 bombs, I'm saying I don't want them to be limited to 10 or whatever.

Is there a way that I can edit this to accomplish that do I need to alter something else in the ROM?

SunGodPortal wrote:

67FB1: A9 02 33 9F C5 03 70 A9 05 01 9F C7 03 70 A9 00 00 9F 59 03 70 A0 00 00 60

I'm using this custom SRAM for one of my projects (start in pendant phase with no sword or shield) and I'd like for the player to be able to carry 50 bombs right from the start. I don't want them to start with 50 bombs, I'm saying I don't want them to be limited to 10 or whatever.

Is there a way that I can edit this to accomplish that do I need to alter something else in the ROM?

In this case you need to manipulate the "pond upgrade" values (only way of doing it):

at 274F6= max bomb carrying upgrade
00 is carry 10 bombs at max (no bomb carrying upgrade)
01 is carry 15 bombs at max
02 is 20
03 is 25
04 is 30
05 is 35
06 is 40
07 is 50 (your value to type here, so from 00 to 07= max in Alttp, but it goes on too)

08 is 48 (for some odd reason)
09 is 53
0A is 64
0B is 69
0C is 80 (the only round number)
0D is 85
0E is 96
0F is 112 (will display as 12)

Arrow upgrades:
at 274F7
00= 30 arrows at max
01= 35
02= 40
03= 45
04= 50
05= 55
06= 60
07= 70

08= bug
09= bug
0A= 9 arrows
....
0F= 9 arrows
10= 17 arrows
FF= 26 arrows


How many Bombs you currently have:
at 274C9
00= 0 bombs to start with (your case)
0A= 10 bombs (actual hex to dec value)
0F= 15
14= 20
1E= 30
32= 50
50= 80
63= 99

How many Arrows you currently have:
at 274FD
0F= 15
10= 16
14= 20
1E= 30
32= 50
46= 70 (max in Alttp)
50= 80
63= 99

PS
Custom SRM will let you edit things like even and specially skip the uncle event and will give you the sword and shield (if you choose so) by default.

Cool. Thanks. That'll come in handy.

I thought there was a fix for this somewhere around but I can't find it.

How do you fix it to where Hyrule Magic will display all of entry 371 in the monologue editor instead of cutting it off halfway through "hands"? I compared a clean ROM with an "HM" ROM and there didn't appear to be any difference in that particular piece of data.

SunGodPortal wrote:I thought there was a fix for this somewhere around but I can't find it.

How do you fix it to where Hyrule Magic will display all of entry 371 in the monologue editor instead of cutting it off halfway through "hands"? I compared a clean ROM with an "HM" ROM and there didn't appear to be any difference in that particular piece of data.

This monologue is a pain, since it is extra long. Even if you load the original Rom, this monologue will not display properly in HM due to its length. This is a result of text appearing and vanishing. The vanish is achieved by "loading" the empty space.

If you want to change this monologue, it is recomended to empty it completely first and then fill it with regular text with typing effect and all your problems will be solved.

PS
The original monologue is fine in-game, you just dont have the ability to edit it past that point of display.

Seems like ShadowOne was able to actually get the whole monologue out.

Code:

[Msg 371][Speed 2][Position 0][Window 2]Welcome, [Name][...][Line2]I   am   the   Essence   Of   The[Line3]Triforce.[WaitKey][Scroll][...]   [...]   [...][Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]The Triforce will grant the[Line2]wishes in the heart and mind of[Line3]the person who touches it.[Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]If a person with a good heart[Line2]touches it, it will make his good[Line3]wishes come true[...]  If an evil-[WaitKey][Scroll]hearted person touches it, it[Scroll]grants his evil wishes.[Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]The stronger the wish, the[Line2]more powerful the Triforce's[Line3]expression of that wish.[Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]Ganon's wish was to conquer[Line2]the world.  That wish changed[Line3]the Golden Land to the Dark[WaitKey][Scroll]World.[Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]Ganon was building up his[Line2]power here so he could conquer[Line3]the Light World and make his[WaitKey][Scroll]wish come completely true.[Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]But now, you have totally[Line2]destroyed Ganon.  His Dark[Line3]World will vanish.[Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]The Triforce is waiting for a[Line2]new owner.  Its Golden Power is[Line3]in your hands[...][Speed 1][WaitKey][Line1]                                          [Line2]                                          [Line3]                                          [Speed 2][Line1]Now, touch it with a wish in[Line2]your heart.[Line3][...]  [...]  [...]  [...][End]


Basically what you need to do now is to remove the annoing empty sections and change it to a "standard" typing text, where one line follows another. You see, there is a limit per monologue, and this one exceeds that limit.

I did this in GoW by the way. There the text scrolls normally and is withing the characters limit for one monologue.

Basically what you need to do now is to remove the annoing empty sections and change it to a "standard" typing text, where one line follows another. You see, there is a limit per monologue, and this one exceeds that limit.

I did a bit of experimenting. The triforce message needs all of that space that it takes up to create the effect that it does in game. Unlike much of the other pieces of text, this text relies very little on scrolling and more on the on-screen words being "overwritten" by "blank" spaces. If those blank spaces are taken out you get this:



The text writes itself to the screen without clearing the existing text first. You could fix this by having the text scroll instead (like much of the other text in the game) but that just doesn't have the same visual appeal. Having the end text scroll instead of wiping away feels clumsy in comparison.

The reason why I messed with this so much is because I was trying to find a solution for this so that I could incorporate it into my "starter" patches, leaving newcomers with one less confusing issue. In the end I've come to the conclusion that the best thing to do if one wants the same amount of text with the same effect they should either edit that entry in a hex editor or edit it in HM and then piece it together in the proper spot of the ROM with a hex editor. That's a little tricky to accomplish without causing bugs but if someone has made it far enough into an A Link to the Past hack to NEED to edit the triforce text they've probably already built up the skills they need for it.

Having the end text scroll instead of wiping away feels clumsy in comparison.

In this case there is no way I can help you, since I never bothered to do this in hex, plus - this will bring all monologue editing into a problem. Even if you make this, how will people edit other monologues. If they change just one - the entire hex string of monologues is shifted - which will most likely undo all you did in hex for the Triforce monologue.

In such cases the debug has the priority over aestetics, but it is your call in the end. If you wish to keep the original effect and thus the length, you will need to do it in hex (who knows how though) and it is a question how further editing of monologues will be in HM (similar to indoors, once you hex edit, the change is not compatible with HM).

I can not recomend you this (since the monologue has a logical limit of characters - and this monologue exceeds it, which is a bad idea to keep), but like said, it's your decision to make.

PS
You can keep the "whiping" effect - just don't exceed the limit - ie shorten the text. The whiping effect basically "types" the blank space (no letters) over the previous message, which means a double amount of space is needed to say the same thing. Exceeding the limit of characters is thus logical. So yes it is aesthetic - but not practical nor pragmatic.

Like I said, it's tricky but if someone is almost finished with an A Link to the Past hack they obviously have the skills to pull it off.

I have no skills i almost finished a hack......

Real rom hackers are a dying breed!

This is true...good to see you adam!

Didn't there used to be a program around here for transferring rooms from one ROM to another? I finally tried to use the porting function in the latest version of HM but it kept saying it was too big or something.

How does the game keep track of the properties that overworld GFX tiles have? Like, how does it know which tiles are solid, can be passed under, lifted, etc.? Does it judge the "interaction properties" based on where a tile is located in the tiles sets and which GFX set is loaded at the time or something else? I'm starting to think about my ambitions outside of the Bruce remake and part of the includes drawing entirely new overworld graphics for my hack.

How does the game keep track of the properties that overworld GFX tiles have? Like, how does it know which tiles are solid, can be passed under, lifted, etc? Does it judge the "interaction properties" based on where a tile is located in the tiles sets and which GFX set is loaded at the time or something else?

Imagine a GFX tile set, which has "disassembled" gfx. You can define the tile properties for each pixel freely. This is also in the compendium. For instance all parts of the tree are solid for person and solid for items (ie you can not fire an arrow pass a tree). This is type 1. While type 0 is "walkable" like grass tiles. Type 2 for instance is solid for person but not not for items (arrows, bombs etc can go pass). And there are multiple tipes: shallow water, grass, ice etc, as it is in that table in the compendium.

But the main problem with tile types is this: you define tile types freely, but once you do, the definition is valid for the global gfx location, onto which multiple gfx sets will be loaded.

There are no problems with the "tree gfx" set, since trees are loaded in every gfx number (ie neutral set). But what about the "non neutral" sets, like eastern palace. Those 2 gfx sets are on the exact same location as for instance tower of hera tiles once you change the gfx number.

Imagine the locations thus being "RAM" while the multiple gfx sets are ROM, loaded into RAM locations.
The game is capable of handling 12 to 14 (have to check the exact number) gfx sets at a time while having around 80 sets all together (not counting sprites, since those are seperate, but again same strategy of loading, but interaction with sprites is easier).

Furthermore the "infront" or not infront can be set to every gfx tile-location again but on the left side (checkable). So if you want that you select type 0 (walkable) and in-front. This will make a wall, that Link can walk under, but since there is only 1 layer on overworlds, you can only walk under or above but not both.

Its all doable in Hyrule Magic, it is just complex, since obviously what we would want is to be able to define all types for all gfx sets seprately, which is not doable. The strategy on tile types, which the game is using thus explains why gfx sets are so scattered (since they needed that to define tile types correctly).

Because this is complex, SePH than used his "double layer" strategy with Conker which utilized dark and light world in just one world (thus no dark world). This however will only allow small areas (no big area possible) but he could build complex structures easily.

On the other hand he inserted the Ghost ship (fantastic gfx) into moegami's hack. You can see in this 3gfx set, how he needed to watch where to place the tiles to be compatible with the global tile tipes, but it turned out great.

Okay. Thanks. That was a pretty good explanation. Surely the rest can be sorted out with experience and the info in HM. Of course, if Seph has any tips...

Okay, let's come back to this block type stuff.

I found the block types (I haven't bothered to locate the properties like "in front" yet) for the overworld tiles in the ROM:

Overworld Block Types:

After I found that I went to do the same for the dungeon tiles. HM didn't seem to want me changing these numbers though (the block types for the dungeon tiles). Regardless, I did manage to track them down in ROM, but they appear to be more complex than the overworld tiles. By that I mean there appears to be multiple sets configurations for the dungeon tiles rather than one set like the overworld tiles. So, two questions:

1) Does anyone know how many sets there are for the dungeon tiles?

2) Why wouldn't HM let me change the block types for the dungeon tiles? Does anyone else experience this?

I'm trying to learn as much about this aspect as I can because the way I see it, the more I learn about it the more freedom I'll have with my new graphics designs.

EDIT: It just occurred to me that the variations I'm seeing in the block type data for the dungeon tiles might just concern the part of the GFX set related to stuff like peg switches and the cane of somaria blocks. In that case, I guess what I was looking at in this case might have actually been the block types for the dungeon related sprites, which would understandably be a different set of data all together (which I should have deduced from the fact that they were not connected to the main set of data for dungeon tiles). Anyway, it's late. I'll work on this more tomorrow.

1) Does anyone know how many sets there are for the dungeon tiles?

Same as for overworld, but not all are in use. Thus:
overworld:
4x16= one gfx set,
in RAM= 8 such sets (like on your list)
block is 200 in hex long.

dungeons:
4x16= one gfx set
in RAM= 8 such sets, but
the data block is only 180 in hex long,
so it seems some are unused and don't follow the correct order in hex (unused spaces are skipped in the hex code).

overworld starts at 71459 and ends at 71658.
dungeons start at 71659 and the block is 180 long.
Ends with bytes 00 09 09 09 09.

2) Why wouldn't HM let me change the block types for the dungeon tiles? Does anyone else experience this?

Because it is uncapable of doing so (programing mistake or maybe deliberately done).

I can not suggest changing block types for dungeons at all, since dungeons are object based. So you don't want a lantern which you walk through - then all lanterns can be walked through. Unless you want to fill the object with other gfx and thus overhaul it completely. But you can still overhaul all dungeons without changing the block types.

Not so for overworld, which is drawing based and needs this to be changed.